Todd Bentley: ‘Unhealthy Relationship’ with Female Staffmember
Aug 15 – From the Board of Directors
We wish to thank all of our friends and partners for the overwhelming flood of support and compassion we have received as a ministry on behalf of Todd and Shonnah Bentley. The many phone calls and emails of concern from people who genuinely love the Bentleys and Fresh Fire Ministries have been a great encouragement to all of us here during these past few days. In particular, the rallying of support and prayer for Todd and Shonnah by prominent leaders within the Body of Christ has been a beautiful indicator of the maturity and grace the Lord is bringing to his Bride.
We wish to acknowledge, however, that since our last statement from the Fresh Fire Board of Directors, we have discovered new information revealing that Todd Bentley has entered into an unhealthy relationship on an emotional level with a female member of his staff. In light of this new information and in consultation with his leaders and advisors, Todd Bentley has agreed to step down from his position on the Board of Directors and to refrain from all public ministry for a season to receive counsel in his personal life.
On behalf of the Fresh Fire leadership and the Board of Directors we wish to apologize to our friends and partners and to the larger body of Christ and to ask for your forgiveness. We are truly sorry for the pain many of you must feel and so regret that in the midst of great revival, the enemy has found a way into our camp. To those who have stood by us, we wish to thank you for what in many cases has been years of support. Thank you for your financial giving towards the vision of this ministry, and thank you especially for your prayers. For those of our partners, friends and supporters who may be struggling with the recent disclosures and finding continued support of this ministry in conflict with either conscience or conviction, we release and bless you with all our hearts and trust that God will redeem in your hearts the good that He has accomplished in your lives through this ministry. It is our sincerest hope and prayer that the Lord bless you and bring you into your fullest destiny in Him.
When this ministry was initially birthed in May of 1998, Todd had but one simple desire in his heart – to see the world come to know Jesus. Now, only 10 years later, Fresh Fire Ministries has grown to become a Resource Center that is literally reaching out to all the corners of the Earth. There have been dozens of associate ministries, scores of interns and hundreds of graduates from the Supernatural Training Center. Over 60 nations have received a combined total of more than five million dollars in humanitarian aid and we have seen well over one million conversions for Jesus Christ.
And so, the question can well be asked… where do we go from here? It is true that we are deeply saddened by these recent events, but it hasn’t shaken our faith in either God or His goodness towards us and with the help of wise and compassionate leaders within the body, we will do everything within our power to see our brother and sister healed and restored.
As a ministry, we can not forsake the vision and heartbeat upon which Todd Bentley founded Fresh Fire Ministries which is simply this:
- Matthew 10:7-8
And as you go, Preach, saying, “The kingdom of heaven is at hand” Heal the sick, cleanse the lepers, raise the dead, cast out demons. Freely you have received, freely give.
While Todd and Shonnah each go through the necessary steps towards restoration and wholeness, we are compelled, with the resources with which God has entrusted us, to continue to spread God’s love and power all over the world.
There are many noble activities and endeavors in which Fresh Fire Ministries is involved, initiated by Todd, and to which we are still committed. We have the Supernatural Training Centre, our school of ministry, already in it’s fourth full year and with more than 50 students already enrolled we’re believing for an amazing year of biblical instruction, practical application and encounters with the presence of God. Many mature and gifted speakers and associates, graduated interns and teachers filled brim-full with the DNA and fire of this ministry are ready to pour revelation and passion into the hungry hearts of this coming year’s student body.
We will continue to host conferences in our region with speakers and worship leaders from around the nation whose message and mandates resonate with the vision and heart of Fresh Fire Ministries. In addition, we are committed to supporting the growing “OutPourings” across North America and around the world with our Associates, with encouragement and prayer support. In Todd’s own words, “What God is doing is bigger than one man”, and we now have a golden opportunity as the Body of Christ to pick up the baton and to run with perseverance for His glory.
Our missions department is progressing, as previously mentioned, with our major African crusade. With close to 100 team members in attendance, excitement is beginning to build and team members have responded that they are still believing God for the most amazing missions trip ever! Our Uganda Jesus Village in Kampala is forging ahead with the recent acquisition of 35 acres of land 30 minutes drive from our present location. Two of the 15 homes planned for the property are nearing completion, and the expanded village, when finished, will house almost 150 orphans rescued from war torn northern Uganda.
So whether in our Children’s Home in Africa, in our Supernatural Training Centre in British Columbia, in the revival meetings and outpourings spreading around the globe, or in taking teams to minister compassion and practical assistance to the poor in the far corners of the Earth, we have been and still are committed to bringing love, hope and a demonstration of the saving, healing, delivering power of the Gospel to a world in need.
Thank you all once again for your prayers and support. We bless each and every one of you in whatever decision you must make. Please know that our heart in all of this is to see the name of the Lord vindicated, and we take great encouragement from Psalm 23 and the Lord’s promise that He will “lead us in paths of righteousness for His name’s sake.” Together we look to the mercy and wisdom of our loving Father and we remain as ever, your brothers and sisters in Christ.
The Fresh Fire Board of Directors
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[Source: Fresh Fire Ministries Board of Directors, August 15, 2008,
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End of article.
**************
*sigh*
Many were alarmed at the unscriptural words of Todd Bentley. But a close look at the phrases in the above letter give reason to believe that this ministry will continue in the same fashion.
Encounters with the Presence of God.
Teachers filled brim-full with the DNA (Divine Nature Activated)
Supernatural Training Centre?
One of the reasons that ministries fall flat is that they are not centered on the Word of God. Instead we heard stories about Todd Bentley’s angels who were not biblical. The angels are before the throne of God, yet Bentley said, “they have nothing in heaven to do but waiting to serve God’s purpose in you!”
It was indicated that the Gospel was delivered at the meetings, but never once did I hear a true Gospel message of repentance, and following Christ in faith instead of feelings. Instead we hear of our divine nature which is an occult teaching, not Christian.
I believe this to be my last post on TB. I hope he repents as we all should when we find ourselves in sin. I am no better than Todd though. I too always fall short. But only the truth in the Word of God satisfies, convicts, and keeps us on that narrow path. We all stumble and can be refined when we stay in God’s truth.
38 comments
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August 17, 2008 at 7:39 am
smbga
The Word of God clearly says that many are and will be deceived in the last days. We are in the last days. I knew immediately months ago when I first saw this young man that there was a problem. A big problem!!!! Was I the only one who saw the demons in this young man? Was I the only one who saw deception? Yes, satan can mimmick the gifts, etc….. But the Body of Christ needs to pray for discernment. God have mercy on us all.
August 17, 2008 at 1:00 pm
scott771
I asked if anyone in the renewal movement leadership was listening. Apparently, some are, and they’re beginning to speak out! http://northwestmusings.wordpress.com/2008/08/17/the-dancing-continues-can-you-do-the-twist/
Alan Hawkins, a Pastor in the renewal movement is speaking out. He Pastor’s a Church in Albuquerque, N.M. called New Life City. He made this comment on his blog today:
“I for one hope we play this out just as publicly as we played out the endorsement of Todd Bentley. Our repentance should be as public as our proclamation of revival. Let’s go on God TV and tell the world about our failure, our weakness and our courage to face problems openly and without fear. Todd will find forgiveness from his Christian family. The overseers will find understanding from the body of Christ. And we should expect to find them all open and transparent. I will have more to say about this.”
Thank you, Alan. Your forthrightness is refreshing.
August 17, 2008 at 8:53 pm
Mary B.
personally Scott, I think the whole pool of prophets and seerers and apostles is poisoned. They need to do more than make a specacle out of Todd. They all need to repent in dust and ashes for their lack of scriptural understanding. Todd Bentley is not the main problem.
But, I am not holding my breath that things will change.
August 17, 2008 at 9:28 pm
Kim
Mary i agree with you….it is a polluted pool.
I just read Jewel Grewe’s July/August newletter. She has been researching IHOP and the NAR for some time.
Here she describes when Todd Bentley went to Rick Joyner’s property to visit the famous rock. As they approach the rock there are three angels there giving each other, “noogies.” I kid you not.
Read about it here:
http://www.discernment-ministries.org/NLJulyAugust_2008.htm
Bentley didn’t have a chance.
August 18, 2008 at 10:41 am
James DeVries
When King David sinned, when his family fell apart, was God with him or with the people who cursed him and threw stones at him? Todd Bentleys family problems made me aware that anyone can screw up. We need to care for our brothers in Christ, even the ones who fail us. As for me, I still believe in the power of God to save, heal and set free from sin anyone who believes Jesus Christ.
August 18, 2008 at 11:55 am
mbaker
James,
The excuse that it is okay to do what Todd has done because David did similar things is not a valid one. David and his family suffered severe consequences as a a result of their actions. Here is an excellent article on why the excuse that “David did it” is not a biblically valid one to excuse such behavior:
http://beyondgrace.blogspot.com/2008/08/how-not-to-respond-to-credible-argument.html
While we all pray for Todd and his family to be reunited as God would have them, we simply cannot praise Todd on the one hand as being “anointed” of God and sweep his sexuality immorality under the rug unchallenged. That does a disservice to all faithful ministers of God.
August 18, 2008 at 12:09 pm
Kim
King David’s story is interesting and complex. King David fully repented but there were repercussions that lasted generations.
2 Sam:12:10: ‘Now therefore the sword shall never depart from thine house; because thou hast despised me, and hast taken the wife of Uriah the Hittite to be thy wife.’
Of course anyone can “***** **”. We all fall short and we do need to pray for others. We do have to pay the consequences of our sin though and repent, and turn away from our sin.
August 18, 2008 at 1:09 pm
James
Hi internet bros and sisters! Looks like both mbaker and kim and me are in agreement about this. I offer no excuse for the behavior of church leaders. In comparing Todd’s situation to David, I freely admit there were problems with both of them. There was sin involved in both cases. There are consequences and repercussions in both cases. God clearly is not the cause of broken families and hurt marriages. In my first post I chose words very carefully. Please check it out one more time – see where we all fit into this puzzle. When somebody falls, we need to say only what God directs, despite whatever our own feelings or opinions may be. He is truly bigger and wiser than all of us! Thanks.
August 18, 2008 at 4:37 pm
Lee
James,
I do believe you miss one key point, however. Bentley has NOT publicly admitted his sin or repented. Anyone who is in the spotlight must do this. And, there is absolutely no valid comparison between King David and Todd Bentley. Bentley has not even repented of his obvious lies and lies to cover those lies. Nor has he repented for charlatanism. And, most importantly, he’s not repented or even acknowledged his false doctrine.
When a person aligns themselves with the likes of William Branham [false prophet who did not believe in the Trinity and had his faith grounded in the Zodiac and pyramids in addition to the Bible], Bob Jones [false prophet] and Paul Cain [false prophet and liar who lied at Lakeland about his past alcoholism and sexual impropriety which he admitted to only a few years prior] it’s difficult to take them seriously. And, it’s no wonder, frankly, when their doctrine does not follow Biblical Christianity.
August 18, 2008 at 8:09 pm
Bill Fawcett
Your last post, eh? Give it a few years; he’ll be back.
Now that John “Elijah House” Sandford has restored Paul Cain (how many times has that guy been restored?) I suppose he could take on Todd Bentley if he likes a good challenge. He will have to dig into the root issues of course.
But Lee is right. Bentley will have to repent – confess his sin AND turn from his wicked ways. Tha arrogance (the root issue, John- take note) will have to be dealt with.
Strader has just stated “One of the things we don’t understand is how God uses people of flawed character. People ask me, why choose someone who’s dysfunctional? Because God does it,” he said.
Since we now know that this isn’t the first time, and since many are crying that the sin doesn’t invalidate the so-called revival, I’m proposed that Peter Wagner and the ICA issue a decree stating that it is OK for Bentley to keep concubines. With that settled, Bentley can be happy, God will have his chosen one, and the revival can continue. Because, you know, the sin doesn’t invalidate the revival and God uses people of flawed character.
-Bill
August 18, 2008 at 9:47 pm
Kim
Hi Bill….
I have been gritting my teeth because i said i would not post again about Bentley. I have been reading the back-pedaling in the Global Harvest camp.
Here is an interesting comment from Doris Wagner.
“We felt as though there was a legitimate anointing on Todd’s
life. We knew he was an imperfect person but our honest
desire was to sort out and save the good. The other charge
against us is that we stupidly could not recognize that
these miracles were being done under the power of a satanic
spirit and that we were totally lacking in discernment. My
answer to that is, there probably was some of the flesh at
work on some occasions, and people operating with a higher
level of discernment may have picked up on some things we
could not. I seriously question whether a satanic spirit
got away with all of the good. My conclusion is that it was
mixed and we wanted to help sort out the good. The
Apostolic Team of 11 apostles which Peter put together is
still in the process of sorting all of that out, and time is
needed to do that.”
I am getting ready to post an article from Lynn and Sarah Leslie called,
“Chew the Meat; Spit out the Bones….”
August 19, 2008 at 1:17 am
Dougie McEwan
well Satan or someone got away with the hearts, minds, and money. I wonder if a class action could be taken out to get financial compensation for those poor deluded people. When will Christians learn????.
August 19, 2008 at 6:10 am
beyondgrace
Kim,
I’ve long maintained that a good shepherd does not feed his flock meat with bones in it. I’m calling “metaphor abuse” on that one.
If people of Wagner’s experience cannot operate on a “higher
level of discernment” what hope is there for the sheep.
I will say this, THERE IS NOTHING IN THE WORD OF GOD THAT YOU MUST SPIT OUT.
His Word is LIFE, it is NOURISHMENT, it is LIVING WATER.
Ohhhh, I feel a sermon comin’ on.
-Bill
Ho! every one that thirsts, draw nigh!
(‘Tis God invites the fallen race)
Mercy and free salvation buy;
Buy wine, and milk, and gospel grace.
Come to the living waters, come!
Sinners, obey your Maker’s call;
Return, ye weary wanderers, home,
And find my grace is free for all.
See from the Rock a fountain rise!
For you in healing streams it rolls;
Money ye need not bring, nor price,
Ye labouring, burdened, sin-sick souls.
Nothing ye in exchange shall give,
Leave all you have and are behind,
Frankly the gift of God receive,
Pardon and peace in Jesus find.
Why seek ye that which is not bread,
Nor can your hungry souls sustain?
On ashes, husks, and air ye feed;
Ye spend your little all in vain.
In search of empty joys below,
Ye toil with unavailing strife;
Whither, ah! whither would ye go?
I have the words of endless life.
Hearken to me with earnest care,
And freely eat substantial food,
The sweetness of my mercy share,
And taste that I alone am good.
I bid you all my goodness prove,
My promises for all are free,
Come, taste the manna of my love,
And let your souls delight in me.
Your willing ear and heart incline,
My words believingly receive;
Quickened your souls by faith divine
An everlasting life shall live.
John Wesley
August 19, 2008 at 6:11 am
beyondgrace
Dougie,
When you sow into deception, you reap deception.
August 19, 2008 at 7:38 am
mbaker
There is a rising timidity among the brethren I’ve noticed, that believes speaking out against false doctrine and immorality means we aren’t showing “Christian” love if we dare question these people.
These are the same folks who proudly defended the “miracles” at Lakeland and said to its detractors, “Look at the fruit.” Well, we have seen it for what it is all along, and it is not the Godly fruit of the Spirit that the Bible speaks of, one of which is self-control. That has not been apparent at Lakeland from day one.
Yes, we should love our brothers and sisters in distress, and faithfully pray for their repentance and restoration, but we should not not accept, excuse or condone behavior which is unbefitting to the entire body of Christ when it obviously needs genuine correction instead. When a finger in our physical body is infected, we don’t just cover it with a band-aid, and risk it poisoning our whole body. By the same token, we don’t need to ignore this latest lesson in what happens when anyone arrogantly ignores the boundaries that God has set for us all in His word. They are there for everyone’s protection.
So this is not just about loving and/or excusing one man’s actions, although many folks want to make those who want to apply the necessary Godly correction the real meanies. No, simply excusing or glossing over this kind of conduct as though it never happened won’t do, because it taints the integrity of the entire body. I wonder how many of us think of that before we do something that is opposed to God’s word.
August 22, 2008 at 6:47 am
theresa
I personally visited the Lakeland meetings…there was sincerity from the platform and the thousands of people present. The Word of God was preached; people were prayed for.
I commend the Board of Fresh Fires for handling this situation Scripturally; Todd is stepping down to repent and work on himself. His leadership is calling him to accountability while at the same time walking beside him by providing counsel.
So glad that they are being transparent and not hiding this under a bushel.
May we all walk the walk and as Jesus extends a balance of truth and mercy, may we do the same. Again, they are not ignoring this and saying Oh we are all human….NO, they are saying this is wrong here is your consequence (that’s the TRUTH part). Then because of extending mercy, they are willing to walk alongside with Todd to assist him in getting his life straightened out; may we all walk in truth and mercy!
August 22, 2008 at 10:28 am
Lee
theresa,
So, when did Bentley 1) recognize his sin; 2) confess his sin publicly; 3) repent publicly? I’ve certainly not seen this.
Fresh Fire is just doing their best at damage control. This is not the first time Bentley has been involved in sexual immorality, in case you are unaware. And, have you read the statement by Dutch Sheets? Even he admitted — WAY after the fact — that there were problems in Lakeland. Of course, he’s doing this to further his own ‘career.’
And, what about all of Bentley’s lies to cover up lies that he’s been telling at Lakeland? Oh, yeah, and what about his faulty doctrine? To align oneself with the likes of Branham, Bob Jones and Paul Cain certainly calls one into suspicion [see my comment above @ August 18, 4:37pm].
August 22, 2008 at 11:00 am
Kim
theresa,
Thank you for taking the time to write your comment.
Let’s see what the word of God says about this situation.
1Cr 5:1 ¶ It is reported commonly [that there is] fornication among you, and such fornication as is not so much as named among the Gentiles, that one should have his father’s wife.
1Cr 5:2 And ye are puffed up, and have not rather mourned, that he that hath done this deed might be taken away from among you.
1Cr 5:3 For I verily, as absent in body, but present in spirit, have judged already, as though I were present, [concerning] him that hath so done this deed,
1Cr 5:4 In the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, when ye are gathered together, and my spirit, with the power of our Lord Jesus Christ,
1Cr 5:5 To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.
1Cr 5:6 Your glorying [is] not good. Know ye not that a little leaven leaveneth the whole lump?
1Cr 5:7 Purge out therefore the old leaven, that ye may be a new lump, as ye are unleavened. For even Christ our passover is sacrificed for us:
1Cr 5:8 Therefore let us keep the feast, not with old leaven, neither with the leaven of malice and wickedness; but with the unleavened [bread] of sincerity and truth.
1Cr 5:9 ¶ I wrote unto you in an epistle not to company with fornicators:
1Cr 5:10 Yet not altogether with the fornicators of this world, or with the covetous, or extortioners, or with idolaters; for then must ye needs go out of the world.
1Cr 5:11 But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolater, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat.
1Cr 5:12 For what have I to do to judge them also that are without? do not ye judge them that are within?
1Cr 5:13 But them that are without God judgeth. Therefore put away from among yourselves that wicked person.
This passage is pretty specific that the brother who is sinning must taken from among you. Instead we see a pampering, “whoops”, a tolerance of the sin. It also says that the yeast works through the church and there is no mourning over the damage done to the body of Christ.
We are not even eat with a person who is sexually immortal, are of the world, a drunkard, or are greedy.
Next go to 2 Peter where chapter 2 warns against false teachers.
2Pe 2:1 ¶ But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction.
2Pe 2:2 And many shall follow their pernicious ways; by reason of whom the way of truth shall be evil spoken of.
Many believe as i do, that the heresies are a form of gnosticism. Gnostics believe they have special knowledge, a knowing of celestial beings, and know how to bridge the gap between man and God.
This was a problem in the early church and nothing has changed today.
2Pe 2:14 Having eyes full of adultery, and that cannot cease from sin; beguiling unstable souls: an heart they have exercised with covetous practices; cursed children:
2Pe 2:18 ¶ For when they speak great swelling [words] of vanity, they allure through the lusts of the flesh, [through much] wantonness, those that were clean escaped from them who live in error.
2Pe 2:19 While they promise them liberty, they themselves are the servants of corruption: for of whom a man is overcome, of the same is he brought in bondage.
False teachers say that they are going to be bringing in a “fuller” form of Christianity. This apparentley will “open the heavens” to the “deep things of God.” How easily our young people are being led into deception today.
But the truth is that they are bringing the false fire of Gnostism to all who have itching ears.
Many of us had been watching and observing the rituals at Lakeland. Hours of tape has documented the proceedings. I am sure that there were many who went there to seek and praise God. God bless those who follow Jesus Christ and His commandments. More blessing to those who know what the Bible teaches and find Jesus in the Word of God instead of feelings and emotions which trick the heart, and then the mind.
I do hope Todd Bentley repents. Now those who put TB on the stage are back-pedaling, even saying they knew about his marital problems and drinking beforehand. May God have mercy on those with this lack of discernment and Bible knowledge.
Yes, i also pray that we walk in truth found in the Word, and mercy, for those who have lost the way, because the path is narrow.
August 22, 2008 at 11:59 am
Kim
A portion of Freshfire’s statement to the public:
“we so regret that in the midst of great revival, the enemy has found a way into our camp.”
I see it the other way around- This revival let the enemy into the church- hyped with supernatural stories that would embarrass past greats who actually taught the Bible and seen real salvation commitments by people who wanted to be rescued from sin by Jesus as their savior. No, this had none of “that kind” of preaching. It was something new, fresh, or so they thought.
The above is an excerpt from this new post from Let us Reason. Thanks Bud for the update.
http://www.letusreason.org/Latrain54.htm
August 22, 2008 at 3:14 pm
Mary B.
amen Kim !
August 23, 2008 at 9:51 am
Gladstone Bhasme
It’s my observation that ALL human beings have something to hide!
We are all sinners – even the ones who are quick to point an accusing finger at someone else – and such accusers are only disciples of Satan – the Chief Accuser.
Such accusers are far more clever than the accused in hiding their own sins.
Only the Perfect should ‘throw stones’!!!!!
I am a follower of Jesus Christ and have a deep desire to become more and more like Christ – but I find myself like Paul in the Bible “doing things I don’t want to do or not doing things I want to do”.
When I sincerely confess my sins He is faithful and just to forgive my sins!!
Only Christ in us makes us stand totally righteous before God our Father.
I certainly DO NOT SUPPORT sin of any kind and I don’t understand everything that folks like Todd Bentley do – but I love Todd Bentley and all those accused – because the work that God has started in them (and in me) HE WILL COMPLETE in due course – even if we seem imperfect for a while!!
August 23, 2008 at 10:01 am
Craig Dorsheimer [formerly Lee]
Only the Perfect should ‘throw stones’!!!!!
Are you accusing and ‘throwing stones’ here?
August 23, 2008 at 10:13 am
James
Hey I went on Fresh Fire’s website today; checked out the media center and listened to a podcast (The Secret Place of His Power). I find it difficult to listen to an entire message from Todd Bentley.
I feel the need to leave the room when he talks about Jesus or the presence of God, because I get so hungry to meet God. I can’t even finish the message, because all I want to do is run to my prayer closet and experience Jesus!
Im young (21), and somehow Todd must have tricked me into deception. All I want to do is seek Jesus! In fact, I dont think I can stop!
SO if loving You is wrong, Jesus, then I dont wanna be right!! (oh yes I do like the Bible too, and could have a Bible Fight, but to be honest it doesn’t interest me. After all we all have knowledge. In my experience knowledge puffs up, but love….)
I deeply apologize for the offensive nature of my post. I really do love you all. 🙂
August 23, 2008 at 10:29 am
Craig Dorsheimer [formerly Lee]
James,
Without Truth — correct doctine — one can’t ‘experience’ the Jesus Christ of the Bible.
31Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed;
32And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free. [John 8:31-32 NIV]
Bentley distorts the real Truth. He bases a large of his theology on William Branham [who believed full revelation came from the pyramids, the zodiac + the Bible]. Many of his beliefs have more to do with New Age thinking than Biblical Christianity. His ‘angel’s are no more than ‘spirit guides’ spoken of by New Agers. He even claims DNA means ‘divine nature activated’ according the Supernatural School tab on the FreshFire site. Do you believe James that we are innately divine? The bible says the opposite.
8If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
9If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. [1 John 1:8-9 NIV]
By the above it is clear we have a sin nature — not a divine nature. And, I’m still waiting for Bentley to confess his sin, then repent in front of all the people he’s deceived.
August 25, 2008 at 4:29 pm
cheryl U.
Here is the latest from Peter Wagner re Bentley and Lakeland. Things only are getting worse!
August 25, 2008 at 4:30 pm
cheryl U.
I have a terrible memory! It would help if I included the link: http://pjmiller.wordpress.com/2008/08/25/update-on-bentley-and-lakeland-from-peter-wagner/
August 25, 2008 at 4:56 pm
Craig Dorsheimer [formerly Lee]
My head is spinning from all the ‘spinning’ going on about this thing. You’d think someone in this camp would have received a prophetic word about all this before hand. Then the ‘apostles’ and ‘prophets’ wouldn’t be in this sinking ship. But, I’m confident the ship will not ultimately sink. They’ll connive a way to keep this whole aberrant movement going. There’ll be more carnage for sure until this particular thing is over.
August 25, 2008 at 5:20 pm
cheryl U.
How in the world can anyone continue to think that God was working mightily through a liar and a deceiver, an adulterer and a drunk, (of whom the Word says they will have no part in the Kingdom of God) and more to still be revealed? What kind of a believable “spin” can be put on that? And let’s all remember that not only did none of the apostles and prophets seem to see all of this coming, but right before it started to be revealed they were making all of those glowing prophecies and pronouncements over him. If I were one of that crew, I think I would want to hide my head from the world in embarrassment and not keep trying to make like all things are going just fine.
August 25, 2008 at 5:29 pm
Craig Dorsheimer [formerly Lee]
What kind of a believable “spin” can be put on that?
How about “It was the forces of darkness out there [the ‘heresy hunters’] who ‘cursed’ [this was already said — I forget by whom] this. But, once Todd grows in spiritual
hierarchymaturity, he’ll be ready to be ‘used of God’ again.” I’m sure he’ll need more ‘soaking’ time.Now, cheryl, I’m sure you’re aware about how the ‘new prophetic’ sometimes gets it wrong because “God loads a few blanks” according the Bob Jones — the final authority on prophecy superceding Biblical authority. I KNOW you knew that. 😉
August 25, 2008 at 5:41 pm
cheryl U.
Sure odd that 100% of them got it completely wrong on this one though, huh? Even Bob Jones (or whoever’s) 60% is better than that. I guess God’s gun only has blanks these days and no live ammo?? This whole thing is beyond belief and then some!!
August 25, 2008 at 5:42 pm
cheryl U.
And by the way, Craig, I said “believable spin”!! They just simply have to do better than that!
August 25, 2008 at 5:45 pm
Kim
Yes, i agree. There is a lot of spinning and back-pedaling going on right now.
There are some real gems out there…
And here is some “Chew the meat; Spit out the bones” from Global Harvest Ministries.
“We felt as though there was a legitimate anointing on Todd’s
life. We knew he was an imperfect person but our honest
desire was to sort out and save the good. The other charge
against us is that we stupidly could not recognize that
these miracles were being done under the power of a satanic
spirit and that we were totally lacking in discernment. My
answer to that is, there probably was some of the flesh at
work on some occasions, and people operating with a higher
level of discernment may have picked up on some things we
could not. I seriously question whether a satanic spirit
got away with all of the good. My conclusion is that it was
mixed and we wanted to help sort out the good.”
Does anyone know the Heimlich Maneuver?
August 25, 2008 at 5:49 pm
Craig Dorsheimer [formerly Lee]
Remember also that it was 2/3rds correct prophecy. Numerically that would be 66.66666666% with the 6 repeating to infinity. These ‘incorrect’ [not false, mind you] will be explained as being ‘conditional’ with the ‘condition’ that those practicing ‘Christian witchcraft’ [‘heresy hunters’] would not hold sway.
Well, cheryl, you and I won’t believe it; but, there are enough in charismania who will swallow this hook, line and sinking ship. Most will feel compelled to because they won’t want to believe that the whole thing is a demonic sham.
August 25, 2008 at 5:53 pm
Craig Dorsheimer [formerly Lee]
I see I wasn’t clear on the 2/3rds thing above: this speaks of Bob Jones’ ‘prophetic word’ that prophecies ‘will be no better than 2/3rds correct’ because ‘God loads a few blanks.’
August 25, 2008 at 6:23 pm
Kim
There is something I want to say..we must pray for those who were taken in, those who were seeking help and healing only to be turned away. Many felt healings only because of the emotion of the moment and returned back home in the same condition they left in. People had to be “qualified” to approach the stage. In fact many are worse, trusting in false hope and false desires instead of trusting in the Lord to see them through their sufferings.
Let us not forget John B and his wife who went to Lakeland in hopes to have their dead baby raised. What sorrow. I pray that people eyes, hearts and minds will be opened to the truth. I pray that they turn to the Word of God for the renewing of their mind and soul and start reading their Bibles instead of “soaking” in their own pleasure.
August 25, 2008 at 6:28 pm
Craig Dorsheimer [formerly Lee]
we must pray for those who were taken in, those who were seeking help and healing only to be turned away.
You’re absolutely correct on this. I have done this; but, I’ve been lax recently.
August 25, 2008 at 9:17 pm
cheryl U.
Okay folks, here is another one from Rick Joyner if you can handle it. This is worse spin than Wagner’s, IMO. Probably not good bed time reading! I notice he is promoting a different group of people to deal with Bentley than the one’s that were commissioned to do so by Wagner and company. Another rift in the group maybe?
http://www.morningstarministries.org/Articles/1000036553/MorningStar_Ministries/Media/Special_Bulletins/2008/_13_The.aspx
August 26, 2008 at 5:01 am
Craig Dorsheimer [formerly Lee]
I think we should resist writing off these people and maybe have a moratorium to allow everyone a chance to retract what they have written for the last couple of weeks… There may be some of this in my own writing that I am not able to see because I too am hurt by this situation. Therefore, I am also asking for grace and mercy if this is the case.
Yep, more spinning. They want a chance to take back everything that they said — a chance to futher spin whats already been spun.
The Apostle Paul lamented in I Corinthians 6:5 saying it was to their shame that there were no judges among them, yet they were even called to judge angels.
More scripture twisting. In context the Apostle Paul was telling the Corinthians not to sue one another in the secular non-Christian courts but to have matters brought before the church to be judged by other Christians rather than bring reproach to the body of Christ. From the NIV, “Is it possible that there is nobody among you wise enough to judge a dispute between believers?”
He is saying there are individuals wise enough in the church. All they have to do is enquire of God. This is confirmed in the next verse, “But instead, one brother goes to law against another — and this in front of unbelievers!”